Women

I'm afraid this boils down to a bit of ingrained sexism in society. A man can just be a good actor/character, that is enough to get him fame. He doesn't have to be good looking, men are not expected to be beautiful, if they are good looking it is merely a bonus, not a necessity.

Not particularly stunning, legendary men are common:

Tom Hanks
Marlon Brando
Daniel Day
Morgan Freeman
Jim Carrey
John Candy
John Buluci
Jeremy Irons
Tim Curry (although I would for the last two).

With women, they have to be first and foremost good looking, a woman is expected to be aesthetically pleasing, this often means the personality/acting skill is overlooked. I.e.

Angelina Jolie
Maggie Gyllenhaal
Cameron Diaz
Rachel Weisz
Halle Berry
Jessica Alba

Although arguably good looking, nobody likes them..because they're boring, fake, self obsessed and vapid.

Although there can occasionally be a hotty who has a great personality/skill *adjusts tie*, stunningly beautiful women with personality are few and far between, the rest of the plain women have to be pretty fucking phenominal (skill wise) to make it on to the radar (Kathy Burke).

In fact, if you know the right people, and you're a man, you can do anything. Nic Cage's hideous face and school play acting needs to be dealt with before women can take the big screen.

Personally, I usually don't take actors/actresses into account when deciding whether or not to see a film. The only exceptions I can think of are George Clooney (because he has great taste in scripts) and Johnny Depp (because I have an irrational man-crush on him). Otherwise, I base my decision to see a film almost exclusively on the director and/or screenwriter.

But, yeah, there's no doubt that big name male actors are generally bigger box office draws than big name female actors. Harrison Ford, Tom Cruise, Tom Hanks, etc., will bring in huge numbers just on the strength of their names alone. I don't really understand the phenomenon, though.

But Robe, if you had to name your top ten actors, wouldn't it be mostly men?

I don't think thats it RB, men visit the cinema more than women. And GA is not saying "do you watch films with women stars?", he's saying he fails to find any actress that he really likes, on a non-aesthetic way I imagine. I'm saying it's not his fault, most of the women are insufferable due to the fact that they are chosen for their looks.

Indeed. I believe that's because most films have male protagonists while women are generally stuck in supporting roles-- and thin ones, at that. If more women were the true stars of films I'd certainly know of and appreciate more of them, I'm sure.

In 2007 Warner Bros decided that they were no longer going to look at scripts that featured a female protagonists such as Flight Plan and Invasion.

if you had to name your top ten actors, wouldn't it be mostly men?

For myself, not really. I think Nicole Kidman, Naomi Watts, Cate Blanchett, Natalie Portman, Julianne Moore, Christina Ricci, Rachel Weisz, Toni Collette, Julie Christie, Elizabeth Taylor, Audrey Hepburn, Claire Danes and others would all have a good shot at being in my Top 10 list.

But who *are* actually in your top ten list, here at Listal? I know it's not necessarily your top favorites the way Listal works, but I only have about four women on my first page of "most watched" actors here. It seems a sign of the same thing. And it's not that I don't like actresses. I do think it's that studios aren't generally willing to let a woman carry a film. The Ripleys (of the Alien series) of the world are few and far between. And most, I think suffer from lack of support.

I take it no-one where reads the XKCD blog?

blag.xkcd.com/2008/04/10/two-female-leads/

Personally I favour the females if it comes to picking a film purely based on whos in it. But then again, I've never really been one for being statistically acurate...

Gem, are you kidding me? Is there an official statement anywhere?

I read it here.

www.slashfilm.com/2007/10/07/warner-bros-says-no-more-female-lead-characters/

Looking back on the 'Golden Years' of Grace Kelly, Audrey Hepburn, Marilyn Monroe, Elizabeth Taylor.

In their society as 'women' they had somehting to prove. Men had an ideal of women and how they should look and behave, and they dictated that to women.
These actresses were able to look completly tempting and sexual yet classy and sophisticated, whilst simultanously challenging men's perception of their characters.

They could be witty and have wants and desires of their own, yet ultimately they still wielded to the strenght and charm of the alpha male on screen. This allowed men to see and be challenged by a new type of woman, yet feel secure she still needed him.

Today I think all the mystery women hold has been laid out bare with nothing new left.
We have the ladette, the girly girls, the business women, the mother. Women seem to have given up all their cards in an 'This is me- take it or leave it' stance.

So its very rare for a woman to come to the screen with something hidden, a new spark that can be exploited.

Being on an 'even par' with men, in todays society, as well as in films just leaves us the challenge of being as capable as men on their own turf, proving we can do whatever a man ca, as well as him.

Pitting woman as equals in pysical strenght and as action heros. Clearly isn't going to happen! But yet that is what so many films have tried to do and fail. With a mountain of flopped 'tough gal' movies!

Women need to be re-cast in roles that expoit and celebrate their differences to men, not their similarities.

Be it in integrity, morality, sexuality or other. Not in roles that compares them and competes them against men for recognition.

Women need to be re-cast in roles that expoit and celebrate their differences to men, not their similarities.

Be it in integrity, morality, sexuality or other. Not in roles that compares them and competes them against men for recognition.

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Dionysian Child hit the nail on the head.

I think A. Jolie, is the only woman capable in current movies to have credibility as an action hero.
Of course that is helped by her ample physique as much as anything else.

I think its sad, but everytime I think of a female role model or heroine of mine, it goes right back to Catherine Earnshaw, Tess D'Urberville, Jane Eyre and the crew of their time.

I'm not quite sure what that says....

woaha! I never said that she was great! She is the only successful female action hero, but largely because of that wildness in her, that makes her intriguing!

It was more of a tragic remark that I can only think of one woman who makes a convincing action heroine, and owes it largely to her lips, reckless behaviour and physique.

arent we all happy that women can do what they want now? ah... modern society....

I like Angelina, but think she's sold herself short too often to be credible any more.

I kind of wish that the trend that started in the 80s with Ripley in Aliens, and was continued with Linda Hamilton in Terminator 2 had kept going. That was the kind of female action hero we needed. One with depth, rather than one pretending to be either what a man wants, or a man herself.

Maybe then, we'd have more women in the top spots.

I study actresses more than anything else when it comes to film and television, for me, it's the exact opposite. I can name you lists of women that amaze me, but I'd be hard pressed to find a male talent (especially recently) who could get me into a theatre every time.

For the record, and I realize this is controversial, but I think Meryl Streep does alot of film actresses a great disservice. Sure, she's good, but people have this opinion of her that makes some great, great talents thumbnails in comparison. Meryl Streep isn't the end and beginning of female talent in Hollywood, not by a Country Mile.

Same to me with actors (maybe because I'm female ;)) - I would go to the movies just because some actors are in it whereas I've never been to a movie just because my favourite actress was in it. If it comes to a female I have to like the whole movie, the story, the genre etc otherwise I wouldn't go.
On the other hand I'm gonna watch Terminator Salvation just because of Christian bale who is my alltime fav actor though I don't like Terminator at all.

actresses whom I admire

Meg ryan
Tea Leoni
Angelina Jolie
Julianne Moore
Kare Wuhrer

A film without female element is only seeing the face of a mirror and you must be very good, the woman with her mere presence gives guideline

Truly great actors and actresses dont seek fame or limelight. I worked wih a girl who studied at rada and was absolutely brilliant. She never made a career out of it as she has a larger than average nose and just wasn't the type they look for. She used to do bit work on tv and do travelling theatre for schools. I also think wonderful talents like Julie Walters have never moulded to what others expect and have gone under the radar. Julie could of made a huge Hollywood career after Educating Rita, but she wasnt bothered as she does what she does because its inate.

I have the same problem with Hollywood movies. Even among Oscar winners and nominees there are movies without any significant female character, and it seems that the Academy prefers such movies, as Warner Br. do. For me, the lack of a good female lead strongly diminishes the interest in a movie (two leads, male and female, is perfectly OK). Richard Rush, the director of a terrific movie "The Stunt Man" said that having a strong female lead is one of two or three key ingredients needed for a good movie (in his full-length documentary "The Sinister Saga of Making 'The Stunt Man'"). I agree. His female lead in "The Stunt Man" is Barbara Hershey. She changed her style of acting to a more palatable to the Academy (to the "wet blanket types"), and got a nomination. If you haven't seen her in her old films, you know another actress.

The Hollywood policy is very strange, it was not always like this, and it is different in other countries. It may be not transparent, but many successful movies (movies with a big fan base; it is not clear what is "success" now) with a female lead are foreign movies. For example, "Resident Evil 5: Retribution" with Milla Jovovich is a German-Canadian production. The last year movie "The Three Musketeers" with her is a German-France-UK production, filmed entirely in Europe (including studio parts).

I love to think that it is Steven Spielberg who is responsible. His main achievement is the idea that one can make more money by selecting kids, and not adults, as the target audience. Probably, under 16 the boys are the main moviegoers, and if 10 years old boys are your target audience, you do not need female characters at all. In general, this idea turned almost all interesting movies marginal and hard to see.

I made a list of my favorite actresses (still incomplete). Probably, there will be no list of favorite actors. It would be boring for me to do such a list - it would be populated by names which are on any such a list. In a sense, I am on the same page as The Major; I have much more favorite actresses than actors. But for me they all are severely underemployed and do not get the roles and promotions they deserve.